are half of people here under age 18?

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Posted by jt2377, 02-20-2003, 11:57 AM
my god. almost all the thread that i read here are complian, fraud, misleading...etc. done by Teen. are half of web hosting company on the net that offer less than $10 run by teen? one man show are fine with me but one man show run by teen who are not mature or legal to run a company is not cool.
Posted by SoftWareRevue, 02-20-2003, 12:00 PM
Are you fraudulent misleading us by complaining? The subject of age seems to come up here often.
Posted by MatthewN, 02-20-2003, 12:04 PM
25 here ;-)
Posted by jt2377, 02-20-2003, 12:15 PM
no, my friend. i'm 26 if you want to know but it seem like half of thread here are some wrong doing by under age. i'll like to deal with someone who is legit. i've been lurking here to learn about web hosting. you see, i'm planning to start a computer service company that offer every kind of IT service but since i don't have whole lot of money to get deicate or co-lo server. i plan to use some reseller provider here but my god, man. all these thread that i read scare the bejesus out of me. i thnk i'm going to check with my local isp and see what they offer. unless you got some tips on how to pick a legit provider. thank in advance
Posted by SoftWareRevue, 02-20-2003, 12:26 PM
I certainly understand your concern. Just do as much research as you can on whoever you consider. Then hope for the best. You will find that maturity and immaturity, as well as sound business practices versus having no clue, are not limited to any chronalogical age factor.
Posted by Lesli, 02-20-2003, 12:29 PM
I'm over 30; but you're right in that most of the complaint threads posted here recently seem to be posted by people who are under 18. I'd like to take issue with your "under $10" remark, though. It's possible to find hosting for under $10 a month; but keep in mind that if you go for as many resources as you can grab for that $10, you may wind up with a host who oversells their disk space and bandwidth, offers less-than-stellar support, or is put out of business in short order because they don't make enough revenues to stay in business. How to pick a web host: * when evaluating plan prices, you will probably pay at least $1 a month per gigabyte of allowed bandwidth plus $1 a month per 500 mb of allowed disk space. These are two rules of thumb that have been repeated over and over on this forum. Using these rules won't guarantee that the support is top notch; but it will help you establish a "how low is too low" benchmark. * look for a web host that makes it easy for you to find answers to questions, as well as easy to buy their services. You may need to do this during a trial period or an initial month (many hosts offer a 30-day money back guarantee - you could use this period to evaluate their support services.) * look for a host that has the ability to grow with you, especially as you want to be a reseller. Will you be able to easily move from being a general-reseller to being on a dedicated machine? Do they sell dedicated-managed services? Last edited by Lesli; 02-20-2003 at 12:51 PM.
Posted by jt2377, 02-20-2003, 11:56 PM
thank you. that's kind benchmark to mesaure a web host is what i'm looking for. i guess there are so many thread about rip-off that really got me thinking because a lot of these reseller offer no phone number/ company address. it seem like all the commication go thur internet. should i look for a company who have a phone/address in case i can't reach them over email, icq, aim or forum?
Posted by Kazym, 02-21-2003, 01:04 AM
I (think) I now what you are TRYING to say. But you should REALLY rephrase you words. I am 17, does that mean I am not just as intellectual, if not more, then some 20+ year olds? I get what your saying, you don't want to buy from a crock, but I happen to know some friends of mine who run very legitimate, and profitable businesses of their own who are NO older then I. You should be asking if these people are "newbies" or "crocks".. Not if they are under 18. I take an offense to that.
Posted by DarktidesNET, 02-21-2003, 01:39 AM
I offer some custom plans under $10 (real small) and I'm over 18.
Posted by Samuel, 02-21-2003, 01:43 AM
Kazym... you're 17 =) All 17 year olds think they "Know" what it's like to be older.. they all believe that they are "More mature" than 20, and 30 year olds.. but really, haha you don't know. All the secrets of life are given to you via a manilla envelope when you turn 30.
Posted by addvalue, 02-21-2003, 01:59 AM
costs does not associate with age. We are over 30+, too old from 18. We have several plans cater for those who need a smaller resources but the Business Plan/e-commerce usuage, our costs are above that.
Posted by okihost, 02-21-2003, 02:07 AM
I would say your best bet would be to try and call whatever host you are interested in and speak to someone a sales/support person anyone just to get an idea of the person you are getting ready to do business with, If they answer the phone and say "He's at school won't be home till 3:45 or Sorry Timmy is grounded till next week" you will know to keep looking.
Posted by DarktidesNET, 02-21-2003, 02:35 AM
Haha, OKIHost.
Posted by addvalue, 02-21-2003, 02:41 AM
Nice joke OKIHost! But that's a good idea. Give it a try!
Posted by jt2377, 02-21-2003, 06:08 AM
lol. it seem like all the host on webhostingtalk only offer internet commication. weird...if you have a businese why don't you post a phone number or a physical address so people can trust you more. call me old fashion but it's a no-no for me if i can't contact you by phone or fax or even snail mail. i'm not putting down anyone here. it just seem like half of thread recently posted are people who got screw over by "timmy". i guess if it sound too good to be truce. it probably is. cheer Last edited by jt2377; 02-21-2003 at 06:29 AM.
Posted by jt2377, 02-21-2003, 06:16 AM
ahh...my young obi wan(just a joke) i'm not putting anyone down here. read all the recent threads, please. then you'll know what i'm saying. "are half of people here under age 18" because it seem like a lot of hosts on web hosting talk are operate by minor. who doesn't really care about their repuation in the businese and it's all fun and game to them. Michael Dell start his company at dormroom when he was a freshman at UT. look how he handle his businese and taking it seriously and got where he is today. (i used to work for Dell so i use him as an example) ok...enought of me yacking off. cheer
Posted by jt2377, 02-21-2003, 06:20 AM
oh god. you sound like my dad when i was that age. jesus, you're not that old are u?
Posted by UH-Matt, 02-21-2003, 06:24 AM
Its fairly simple really. People under 18 cannot enter legally binding contracts, therefore they shouldnt be allowed to run a company at all. Regardless of what "know it all" pre 18 people think - they CANNOT be trusted to run a company because they are not old enough to take any liability for mistakes.
Posted by pattox, 02-21-2003, 06:46 AM
Thats the problem with reseller accounts, they seem to attract an unwanted audience within the industry.
Posted by simonclark, 02-21-2003, 06:52 AM
Ok so they can sign contracts etc. Some people younger than 18 are more mature than older people & can be more trusted.
Posted by UH-Matt, 02-21-2003, 06:55 AM
I dont think under 18's can sign legally binding contracts here in the UK... where are you from israel?
Posted by MatthewN, 02-21-2003, 06:55 AM
I agree UH-Matt. Although I am sure under 18's do have a lot of great ideas and are good at learning. But taking on a business below 18 is not good for the reasons you mentioned. Nothing to stop them working with an over 18 with their ideas but that person would have to be trust worthy.
Posted by jt2377, 02-21-2003, 07:00 AM
not to put anyone down but it feel safer to do businese with whom you can take to the court. businese is businese. it's not all game and fun.
Posted by MatthewN, 02-21-2003, 07:01 AM
simonclark... Its hard to say if someone younger or older is trust worthy or not. People of any age can be trust worthy or not. I see that the main problem is, is that if a business messes you around and you need to take legal action then if someone is under 18 then how could justice really be served and how do you calim money back. It just makes things more complicated.
Posted by MaxiSNK, 02-21-2003, 08:44 AM
well im 21 engaged and running a farm buisness with my girl so i know all about commitment and how vital customers are to you
Posted by sprintserve, 02-21-2003, 09:55 AM
Well. It's true that not all under 18 are irresponsible and untrustworthy. But: 1. Ability to enter contracts: It is rightly pointed out that if you are a legal minor, you can't enter contracts. Whether you are the next Bill Gates or Michael Dell, the fact that you cannot be held responsible is something that makes for a skewed learning path. 2. The truth is: most problems I faced are with people who are below a particular age level. While it is true they are exceptions, the fact that even if half of them aren't matured enough, it spoils the broth. In fact you just need one (Timmy anyone) 3. And indeed, a lot of complain threads seems to be started by minors... very much like a childish tantrum. Those don't help very much either. (remember perhaps what you use to do in Elementary school when your toy got snatched? )
Posted by doobie, 02-21-2003, 10:09 AM
People under 18 lack experience, high level education, and have to go to school half the day.
Posted by sprintserve, 02-21-2003, 10:17 AM
Frankly high level education is just bull**** Studying in a college won't give you better business ethics or morals. But yes.. they will probably need to go to school half the day =
Posted by doobie, 02-21-2003, 10:26 AM
I never said it will give ethics and morals. People that go through college generally in most cases know what they are doing and are less likely to fail or give up their business than some 16 year old running a biz on his free time.
Posted by Lesli, 02-21-2003, 12:50 PM
jt2377, I think that part of the reason that so many threads here on WHT seem to be started by children - or at least by childish people - is that hosts who want serious discussion, or hosts who want to advertise to a serious market, may be put off by the conversational climate here. Thus they don't post (or don't advertise - that's my case, personally.) And so more people post fluff or irate threads, seeing them in the majority. And so fewer people post serious questions or weighty issues, thinking that they won't be well answered or discussed. And so...vicious cycle. I don't have a contact phone number because by having all client communication go through the Internet, I have a written record of all conversations that take place. This hasn't been needed thus far, but it can help if we run up against an unscrupulous client who attempts to cheat us - we can just reiterate the text of emails exchanged if the issue goes to court. I do provide a phone number to my clients...but it's in the clients-only area. If you're looking at hosting companies, you may want to take that into account; and also remember that even if someone publishes a toll-free number, it may only reroute to a house line and it may not be answered promptly. Give the toll-free number a call and test the response. Check emails the same way.
Posted by nicholasm, 02-21-2003, 01:47 PM
LOL. Shucks Samuel, now the secret's out! They're supposed to find out by themselves. ;P Seriously though, there are always exceptions. Indeed not all people under 18 will screw you. Heck, there are many people over 40, 50, 60 and 70 that screw more people away. But you also have to understand, a lot of them teenagers will, if not by intention, then by other reasons that well, teenageers under 18 succumb to. Boredom. Party. School. etc. You guys may not do it, but a lot of people in your age bracket will. And these reasons narrow down as people get older, and hence it will be amusing, but it is less likely that people will want to put a lot on the line (like a small business, legitimate income to pay for the mortgage or food on the table) on matters like a web host (among a few other things) that can make or break them if they knew a kid ran it, and may run away with it at a huff. Just my $0.02
Posted by ChickenFart, 02-21-2003, 01:48 PM
Now that's scary. You're the kind of customer I wouldn't want, and it's attitudes like yours that make ToS' so protective for the host That said, it would be hard for you to find a host that you can take to court, if you've agreed to the standard ToS, you wouldn't have a leg to stand on.
Posted by Aussie Bob, 02-21-2003, 01:58 PM
Well mine must have got lost in the mail. I know everything anyway, so I really don't think I would derive some form of benefit from it.
Posted by Samuel, 02-21-2003, 02:10 PM
Bob, check your PM Ill need your address and 29.95 USD in order to give you a copy of the "Secrets of Life"
Posted by sprintserve, 02-21-2003, 02:15 PM
Mine is a recycled copy. It just cost 29.90.
Posted by SoftWareRevue, 02-21-2003, 02:16 PM
You talk like a teenager, Nasty B.
Posted by Lesli, 02-21-2003, 02:50 PM
Oh no...**that's** what that was?!?? I thought it was just marketing fluff! scrambles for the document shredder and scotch tape
Posted by jt2377, 02-21-2003, 03:39 PM
sometime you need to protect yourself. agree? i don't want to get screw or screw someone else that's why we have law to weight in on that kind of matters but you probably right. i won't have a leg to stand on it if i do agree to the ToS but still...
Posted by Lesli, 02-21-2003, 04:27 PM
A tip, to help keep from "getting taken" in any situation: * don't agree to anything you don't understand * know that you may have additional rights not spelled out in any hosting TOS. These rights vary from place to place. Check with your state's or province's consumer affairs department of your government (if your country's government has such a thing) * don't think of lawsuits as your first line of defence. Like divorce, or chargeback, it should be something done when nothing else works. (And to be fair, that's the first thing you will have to do in some situations. Work with your consumer affairs department / advocate on this one. They'll advise you on the most effective course of action.)
Posted by nieve, 02-21-2003, 04:45 PM
I'm 16 and I'm a loser.
Posted by PixelAxis, 02-21-2003, 06:44 PM
It's true, people under 18 think they know what to do but they don't. It takes a lot more than knowing a few things about servers to run a successful business (and this is coming from someone who is under 18)
Posted by alexconconi, 02-21-2003, 09:15 PM
I dont like to make enemies, but i have to say this: R. K. ****, Age can be made into a statistic, and maybe a good one that should be paid attention to. It is also smart to recognize that minors can't enter contracts, and other laws and circumstances such as school and education... But give teens a break... I don't care if you are one or not.. Your comment is stupid. All the negatives I listed above aren't just about "thinking they know but they dont". Your comment is just a bash and unprouctive and your narrow minded thinking pisses me off... And the fact that you're under 18 and are making a comment about how people under 18 think they know it all is just a bit ironic. I dont know if your just trying to be cool and agree to what others say or what.. but shut up.. *please*. Ofcourse this is completely all my opinion,... -Alex Last edited by alexconconi; 02-21-2003 at 09:23 PM.
Posted by sHosts, 02-22-2003, 12:36 AM
Is the glass half empty or half full
Posted by KPkid, 02-22-2003, 01:05 AM
well im 17 and i don't run a buisness for that reason. all i know is im being smart and taking buisness classes so when i turn 18 (in a few months) i know what to do when i possibly go to run a buisness of some sort but i DO think some teens know what their doing and others dont.
Posted by PixelAxis, 02-22-2003, 01:06 AM
Most likely you are also under 18, am I wrong? Yes my comment is a bit ironic, but going through some experiences I have realized this is the truth and it applies to many of the teens trying to run businesses. Of course there are a few rare exceptions, but you will find that no matter how mature you are for your age it takes good experience to become successful most of the time.
Posted by rusko, 02-22-2003, 02:46 AM
rk, well said. i think you made a wise choice when you decided to design kickass templates and not run a dubious hosting business =]
Posted by TheTech, 02-23-2003, 09:28 AM
Judging from what you said, i don't understand how age reflects business style. -- I've seen more adults pull off great scams, than a minor. And then it seems like you all of a sudden didn't care about age, you just want a legit host. Which one is it? LOL
Posted by dilvie, 03-05-2003, 10:13 AM
He's right.. well, not about the manila envelope, but experience is a GOOD thing to look for when you're choosing a host. How many 17-year olds can say they have 10 years of experience in unix administration? When I was 17, I only had 2 years of unix experience, (one year pro) and, though I thought of myself as a unix wizard, I would have made a lousey administrator for a multi-client managed hosting company. =) I thought I knew a lot more than I did. At least now I know better what my limitations are. I know what I can and cannot promise a lot better.
Posted by dilvie, 03-05-2003, 10:30 AM
How many teens have taken college level financial accounting courses that will at least teach them that they don't know jack and they should probably hire a professional accountant? How many know how to guage market data and find a niche in which they have the ability to compete well? How many know how to market themselves effectively once they've found that niche? These are all things you will learn in your college business courses. High-school business courses won't give you many clues about the things you don't know that could make or break you in the real world. Some things can only be gained through experience. Other things (good accounting practices, for instance) require a few years of college-level schooling. I agree that many adults (even those who have gone to college) ignore good business practices and still run scams -- but when your mortgage is on the line, you're far more likely to take your business seriously. - Eric (25)
Posted by tazzy, 03-06-2003, 01:03 AM
Hello, I'm under 18. Does that mean I cannot be as good as someone over 40? or over 18? If so why? I have experience. I don't have as much experience per say as someone who is 40 and has been working since they were 16 and has degrees and so on and has worked at the top and still is working at the top. However, why should I be made to feel under-class just because of my age? What about my actions as in real life? What about what I know and how I use what I know? Does that count for nothing? I could argue my case for being an under 18 year old businessman, which by the way I am not. For a very very long time. You however could also argue the case for being an over 18 year old business for an equally long time. I however am going to use the time I could waste on doing so in spending my time doing things I want to do. I have given up trying to explain who I am and what I can do to people who don't want to listen but just talk. I'm not perfect but I do not prefer being classed as anything less than what I am. I prefer for people to actually base their opinions on what is actually so and not what other people say based upon their views or guess work. I have the greatest respect for people who back their views up even if I do disagree with them passionately. Such as one of AussieBob's views on ages in business. Have a great day.
Posted by mushrew, 03-06-2003, 01:54 AM
I'm guessing the horror stories relating to TimPD have something to do with many of the comments in this thread. Just because one minor managed to rip off hundreds of people out of tens of thousands of dollars of money doesn't mean that all minors are that way. Though I am a minor myself, I have my own successful game server business that generates more than enough revenue each month to pay for over 30 high-end dual processor dedicated servers and several colocation fees as well as the colocated servers themselves. I don't provide all day technical support myself because obviously I can't since I have other needs to attend do (school, doing data collection & analysis at a local biotech company), but that's why I have adult employees being paid actual wages to handle technical issues. We recently opened a small office based in Florida that can support several employees for handling a 1-800 support line. The argument of a minor getting grounded and causing their customers chaos may fall true for some, but I have maintained a high standing GPA that surpasses 4.0 and my parents are well aware of my business and its importance to my customers (they themselves majored in business) thus a situation of me being grounded is highly unlikely exist. Sure, there are risks associated with my business since my life could just collapse at anytime, and I've probably knocked down a few potential customers with this post, but I just wanted to point out that not every minor is a TimPD. Some can (and do) sucessfully run their own legitimate hosting related business.
Posted by DarktidesNET, 03-06-2003, 06:20 AM
It's not that "you don't know what you're doing". You're not of age. You're breaking the law. Simple as that. If I pay anyone any money I like to know I can sue them, and them directly, not have their mommy and daddy to deal with, which is what would happen because your parents are responsible for all your actions until you're a legal adult, which is 18 in America. --- edit I'm not against underage people in the Biz, only owning them and running them because they're not legal age. I have a 17 year old buddy who helps do things on mine (backup admin). He knows his ****, no doubt, knows a lot more about Linux and Unix than I do, that's for sure. But he couldn't have anything in his name. Now, perhaps people underage do run companies, well things they get paid for, but do you have business liscneses and what not? From what I know, it's impossible for a minor to obtain one without it being in someone elses name... but correct me if I'm wrong. As I said, it's merely legal issues that are the main reason. There's no doubt tons of young people know a lot more than older folks, but they can't be held responsible, simple as that.
Posted by jt2377, 03-06-2003, 08:23 AM
legit host = legal age. i believe there are a lot of post in this thread that point this out. do you perfer to deal with a company who have legit businese license or someone who is not what they say they are.
Posted by Rochen, 03-06-2003, 06:12 PM
Under 18 year olds, no. They can't make a contract. However, to be a director of a UK Ltd. company you must be 16. The 16 year old can then act on behalf of the company (not as a 16 year old, but the company) and sign cheques, make contracts etc. in the company name. A 16 year old can't however personally sign a contract - you need to be over 18 to do that. A Ltd. company can enter into a contract as it pleases and a 16 year old has the power to enter the company (not them personally) into the contract, fully legally, providing they are a Director of the company. Things such as a 16 year old sole trader or partnership are completely illegal and they can't enter any contracts as they are entering it personally which isn't allowed. The problem comes, that not many 16 year olds are registered directors of a UK Limited company, so generally speaking, it's illegal. Last edited by Rochen; 03-06-2003 at 06:18 PM.
Posted by atjeu, 03-06-2003, 07:45 PM
very interesting the different laws in the different countries - no one under 27 here - most in their mid 30's and one guy who is 80!
Posted by Alan - Vox, 03-06-2003, 07:56 PM
They are not illegal, I know I use to be one Contracts did have to be signed for by a parent.
Posted by Rochen, 03-06-2003, 08:27 PM
Yes, they are legal providing there is someone over the age of 18 to act on behalf of the partnership. However, they are otherwise illegal
Posted by NFLinsider, 03-06-2003, 11:15 PM
I cant even count the typos in that thread. I mean seriously before you call everyone kids you should atleast learn proper english, after all they are kids and your a adult, set a good example for them..lol
Posted by Slayer, 03-07-2003, 12:26 AM
Well I'm only 17 but I certainly have no intentions of starting a biz until i'm atleast 20 (when I graduate from college hopefully ). I would be bothered if my host was run by someone my age even if they were really good at what they do. Age does make a difference.
Posted by jt2377, 03-07-2003, 09:17 AM
QUOTE]Originally posted by NFLinsider I cant even count the typos in that thread. I mean seriously before you call everyone kids you should atleast learn proper english, after all they are kids and your a adult, set a good example for them..lol [/QUOTE it's a bbs. Not a freaking CNN news report. i ask a question, if most reseller here are under the legal age or not? like i said in this thread there are a lot of resellers scam post here cuased by them. you don't like the topic. DON'T REPLY. seriously...are you a Engrish Naiz or something? Last edited by jt2377; 03-07-2003 at 10:24 AM.
Posted by jt2377, 03-07-2003, 10:59 AM
one more reply for the road. there is no need for personal attack. when i start the thread i didn't expect it to have this much reply. i just stated the fact, recently most post here are about scams done by minor. i've stop my post at page2. i guess this topic strike a lot of people. btw, half of thread here doesn't use "proper english" should i start a topic and ask how many people here who run a webhosting biz can use proper enlgish? Don't be a smart a$$. Last edited by jt2377; 03-07-2003 at 11:48 AM.
Posted by hux, 03-07-2003, 11:30 AM
I agree with the legal age sentiment. I know minors who know their stuff better than I do, and I won't hesitate to ask them for help - and pay them what they're worth regardless of age. but - it doesn't matter what's in yer TOS document if yer not old enough to be legally bound to it. Nothing to do with maturity, emotional stability, etc, etc...it's the law. At least in the US.
Posted by Lesli, 03-07-2003, 11:35 AM
jt2377, on your question about proper English: some of the hosts here have English as their second or even third language. Others are, exactly as you imply, less than good at online communication. I studied linguistics, so I know how languages change pronunciation, syntax, even semantic structure. It will be kind of interesting to see where the proper grammatical structure of the English language goes in 50 years. (100 years would be even more interesting - but I'm probably not going to live to 130+.)
Posted by jt2377, 03-07-2003, 11:46 AM
I'm simply reply to NFLinsder's mock of my typo. please don't take it the wrong way.
Posted by SoftWareRevue, 03-07-2003, 11:49 AM
I take it you've never seen an "Age" thread here before then.
Posted by jt2377, 03-07-2003, 12:02 PM
no. i'm new to this bbs. i got the link from other bbs.
Posted by OPPressed, 03-07-2003, 08:28 PM
In doing business with companys who make regular posts I noticed you cant start asking them any technical questions before asking them if they have a car, or ever got laid... Last edited by OPPressed; 03-07-2003 at 08:45 PM.

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